Highest HP Series 1 L67?
#21
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Joined: Apr 2006
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From: Dimondale, MI
Interesting indeed. I do know though,
"Horsepower sells cars. Torque wins races"
But around 300 is indeed impressive. It would be faster if in a smaller/lighter car, though hell, even my Reatta is around 3400 lbs stock, and that'* a two seater. I'd think a Bonnie is not much more than that. With all this known, it seems I could easily step up my game if I wished
For what I'd eventually like to be at, I guess I won't need a Series II after all
"Horsepower sells cars. Torque wins races"
But around 300 is indeed impressive. It would be faster if in a smaller/lighter car, though hell, even my Reatta is around 3400 lbs stock, and that'* a two seater. I'd think a Bonnie is not much more than that. With all this known, it seems I could easily step up my game if I wished
For what I'd eventually like to be at, I guess I won't need a Series II after all
#22
You don't need a Series 2. You may WANT one though.
With all the mods available for both, the choice you have to make is WHERE do you want it? Torque down low, or torque higher up?
Chadow427 runs mid 13'* in his 2000. I can beat him to the 1/8 (have video from WCBF that clearly shows it) by a length or two. He runs me down from there. Beating him to the 1/8 was done chirping tires in 2nd gear, and losing a bit off the launch with a slight spin.
With all the mods available for both, the choice you have to make is WHERE do you want it? Torque down low, or torque higher up?
Chadow427 runs mid 13'* in his 2000. I can beat him to the 1/8 (have video from WCBF that clearly shows it) by a length or two. He runs me down from there. Beating him to the 1/8 was done chirping tires in 2nd gear, and losing a bit off the launch with a slight spin.
#23
Originally Posted by willwren
Estimates from the habitual WCBF track hounds that drove her (nearly everyone did) put the Zilla right on the edge of the 13'* with good traction.
I've never seen a car trapping less than ~97 or so break into the 13'* and that was on a damn good run.
The video is posted. But remember, a Series 1 is alot more likely to be able to do that than a Series 2, simply because the torque peak is developed at a much lower RPM.
Also, at your shifts, you're nowhere near your peak torque. The Series II is a lot closer to its peak torque at shift rpm and therefor would actually be able to do it easier. Yours does it because you have a shift kit....my L36 barked the tires on the 1-2 shift N/A.
Chadow427 runs mid 13'* in his 2000. I can beat him to the 1/8 (have video from WCBF that clearly shows it) by a length or two. He runs me down from there. Beating him to the 1/8 was done chirping tires in 2nd gear, and losing a bit off the launch with a slight spin.
Even my L36 N/A had more power down low than your SI L67 according to the times I've seen. I went 9.35 @ 75 in the 1/8 in my L36 car with 4 mods, and I can garuntee you that even a stock SII L67 car has more low end balls then that did. I really can't see how if a basically stock L36 can take you to the 1/8 that a 13 second L67 car couldn't.... It was driver error or traction, period.
I hate to burst your bubble, but a car that traps 92mph is capable of mid 14'* at best. But, not that I would know, its not like I've had any experience with 14 second cars before. (looks at own sig... )
#25
Originally Posted by bonnie94ssei
but peak torque in a series II car is made at right around 3000rpm or so
#26
Originally Posted by dbtk2
Originally Posted by willwren
Estimates from the habitual WCBF track hounds that drove her (nearly everyone did) put the Zilla right on the edge of the 13'* with good traction.
I've never seen a car trapping less than ~97 or so break into the 13'* and that was on a damn good run.
The video is posted. But remember, a Series 1 is alot more likely to be able to do that than a Series 2, simply because the torque peak is developed at a much lower RPM.
Also, at your shifts, you're nowhere near your peak torque. The Series II is a lot closer to its peak torque at shift rpm and therefor would actually be able to do it easier. Yours does it because you have a shift kit....my L36 barked the tires on the 1-2 shift N/A.
Chadow427 runs mid 13'* in his 2000. I can beat him to the 1/8 (have video from WCBF that clearly shows it) by a length or two. He runs me down from there. Beating him to the 1/8 was done chirping tires in 2nd gear, and losing a bit off the launch with a slight spin.
Even my L36 N/A had more power down low than your SI L67 according to the times I've seen. I went 9.35 @ 75 in the 1/8 in my L36 car with 4 mods, and I can garuntee you that even a stock SII L67 car has more low end balls then that did. I really can't see how if a basically stock L36 can take you to the 1/8 that a 13 second L67 car couldn't.... It was driver error or traction, period.
This isn't idle smack-talk. My runs were all witnessed by over a dozen members here.
I hate to burst your bubble, but a car that traps 92mph is capable of mid 14'* at best. But, not that I would know, its not like I've had any experience with 14 second cars before. (looks at own sig... )
Comparing your high-compression supercharged L36 with different gear ratio, different weight, different PCM, and totally different base motor to mine isn't going to get anyone anywhere in this discussion.
#27
Originally Posted by willwren
I beg to differ. The S1 L67 shifts AT peak torque. Which is why we burn up 2nd gear clutches and blow out differentials at 2nd shifts, and the S2 doesn't.
The only hp/tq curves I've seen where you would want to shift at peak tq is a CSC powered engine.
#28
Originally Posted by 95naSTA
Originally Posted by willwren
I beg to differ. The S1 L67 shifts AT peak torque. Which is why we burn up 2nd gear clutches and blow out differentials at 2nd shifts, and the S2 doesn't.
The only hp/tq curves I've seen where you would want to shift at peak tq is a CSC powered engine.
#29
Originally Posted by willwren
I'll take Shadd, Paul, and Pdad'* opinions at a pretty high level of 'expertness' in this case, since they've driven the car and seen it run. Thanks for your opinion, though.
I beg to differ. The S1 L67 shifts AT peak torque. Which is why we burn up 2nd gear clutches and blow out differentials at 2nd shifts, and the S2 doesn't.
Chadow427 runs mid 13'* in his 2000. I can beat him to the 1/8 (have video from WCBF that clearly shows it) by a length or two. He runs me down from there. Beating him to the 1/8 was done chirping tires in 2nd gear, and losing a bit off the launch with a slight spin.
Even my L36 N/A had more power down low than your SI L67 according to the times I've seen. I went 9.35 @ 75 in the 1/8 in my L36 car with 4 mods, and I can garuntee you that even a stock SII L67 car has more low end balls then that did. I really can't see how if a basically stock L36 can take you to the 1/8 that a 13 second L67 car couldn't.... It was driver error or traction, period.
This isn't idle smack-talk. My runs were all witnessed by over a dozen members here.
I hate to burst your bubble, but a car that traps 92mph is capable of mid 14'* at best. But, not that I would know, its not like I've had any experience with 14 second cars before. (looks at own sig... )
#30
Originally Posted by dbtk2
And their "high level of expertness' lets them have some miracle feel for how fast a car is. Different cars feel completely different. There are LS1 cars that feel like easy 10 second cars to me that are damn near stock and run 13'* just because of their suspension setup and whatnot. Your car wasn't spinning THAT bad. You don't make THAT much torque. I'm not saying it was a perfect run, but with that trap speed that car won't run any better than 14.50'*.
You see, you weren't there, and they were.
Series II has A LOT stronger trans. I have cars with 4t60'* in them, they are junk compared to a 4t65. I burn up all the damn gears in my 3.1 car...all it tells me is the trans is weak. Blowing out your small differentials tells me that exact same thing as well. Have you compared the 4t65'* HD diff to yours? Its WAY bigger.
With equal traction, the SII car is going to have you the whole way. The only reason you beat him was due to traction or launching differences.
I realize you had "traction issues" off the line. And he didn't. You know what that tells me, HE WASN'T LAUNCHING AS HARD AS HE COULD'VE.
Yup, your 14.6 runs were witnessed by over a dozen members. I agree with you. But your traction issues really don't make as much of a difference as you think. I'm sure those members will tell me you were spinning, and I'm sure they'll also tell me you were running 14.6. Spinning almost always gives you a higher trap speed too. Put some slicks on it and watch as you get 14.5'* all day.
I never said you didn't have lack of traction, I believe you did (I mean your running a damn 2.2" pulley), I also believe that with a trap like that, its not as bad as you think. Remember, I'm the guy running mid 12'* on street tires, I know about traction issues and I know that even I would be hard pressed to drop 6 tenths with traction, even though my tires spin from a 50mph roll and I don't get traction until somewhere around the 330' mark and thats at Norwalk. My tires aren't breaking loose at the 1-2 shift, they're still spinning, they spin right through the 1-2 shift and keep on going. I also understand that your car is heavier than my L36 GP, thats a given. But what I am saying is, if my almost stock L36 in a car that isn't THAT much ligher can take you to the 1/8, then I don't see any reason at all why an L67 car with equal mods as you wouldn't walk all over you up and down. Because it would. Gearing and weight does make a bit of a differnence, but the torque and power difference of an L67 vs. L36 more than makes up for it.
You obviously have NFC about how the power of a S1 is delivered. Out West, we didn't either until 2004. This is the 3rd year in a row with BOTH of my cars that I beat all the S2'* off the line with LESS mods than some of them.
My advice to you is to experience it for yourself before you make your theorized claims. In the meantime, maybe you should just sit back and watch the WITNESSES from Woodburn this Summer chime in.
That is, assuming they feel like arguing with your expert-ness. This topic is WAY off topic, thankyouverymuch.